Boxpipe - Complaint by Secxs

Discussion in 'Admin Complaints' started by Secxs, Aug 13, 2017 at 7:46 AM.

  1. OP
    Secxs

    Secxs New Member

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    Secxs
    Do you wish to allow community input? Pick One : (For Admins Only / For Everyone) :Everyone
    Your Byond Key: Secxs
    Admins Byond Key: Boxpipe
    What did they do?
    : Boxpipe warned a player named Jimmy James I ahelped about. Jimmy(Engineer) came into R&D, broke all the consoles and beat me into crit because I did not want to use his strange object at round start(I was a Scientist). When I later took revenge on Jimmy by gibbing him, Boxpipe adminkilled me "for taking revenge against someone I ahelped about". Jimmy was hulk and wearing a hardsuit. I punched him a few times before he beat me into crit and when I ahelped it Boxpipe replied saying I attacked Jimmy first. Jimmy broke into my workspace and destroyed everything, so of course I attacked him, and of course I took revenge on him for randomly killing me. The only reason I recovered out of crit was because I downed tricord during the fight and because Gop Stop the CMO pulled me from Jimmy's grasp and saved me.
    How did this affect you?: Made me seriously doubt the competency of Boxpipe and made me salty because the justice I dispensed for myself was ruined by an Admin who apparently doesn't know when people are valid
    Supporting Logs: http://tools.hippiestation.com/stats/round.php?round=21691
    Did you read the rules?: Yeah
    Is your post title formatted as such "(Admin Key) - Complaint by (Your Byond Key)": Yes
    Your comments:
    Attacking a player for breaking into your workspace and destroying it - Valid
    Taking revenge against a player who randomly killed you - Valid
    Being adminkilled for all of the above - NOT FUCKING VALID.

    How is this guy an admin when he makes judgement calls like this? Am I in the wrong?
     
  2. Arzion

    Arzion Game Admin Staff Member Game Admin

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    First things first, adminhelping means you leave the entire situation as IC unless an admin tells you otherwise. Having people seek revenge after ahelping and not being fine with the punishment dealt to someone is bad.

    By default, hulks are valid if they destroy the station, seeing as they are unable to be stunned or even weakened, with lethals being the only way to subdue them. Him breaking all of your consoles is a punishment that is better handed based on the previous amount of notes the player had. If the player barely had any previous notes, a warning is sufficient. If the player had a sizeable amount of notes, they are open for much more severe punishments. In this case, the player in question previously had no notes, but has been given a note at the conclusion of the situation.

    Defending your workplace from being destroyed is allowed, as otherwise you would have no job. You were able to assault the hulk if they continued to wreck your workplace after the adminhelp has concluded. However, if you attacked him as revenge after he destroyed your workplace and stopped, but an admin verdict has been given, there is nothing we can do.

    Personally, I believe that being adminkilled was not the correct way to go. Only a warning or a punishment would have been a much more suitable way to go. I am in favor of only accepting a part of the complaint, as the rest of the complaint appears to be justified for Boxpipe. The part of the complaint I vote to accept is the adminkill and nothing else.
     
  3. DinduStuffin

    DinduStuffin Game Master Staff Member Game Master

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    When you ahelp, you leave all punishment to the admins. That does not mean go out and gib the guy for it. You already got him in trouble, action does not need to be taken IC. After Boxpipe explained it to me, I feel like his call, albeit incredibly harsh, gets the point across pretty well that handling a situation you just ahelped about yourself isn't good.
     
  4. OP
    Secxs

    Secxs New Member

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    Let me try and put things in perspective here using some logs.

    First of all, this guy didn't just destroy the 4 consoles originally in R&D. I had spent all shift building 14 additional consoles / computers and this guy went out of his way to wreck most of them. Deliberate grief (that he admits to re: #2379)

    Second of all, my adminhelp occurred around #2256 [06:14:17]. Jim continued to be shit 9 minutes after this(re: #3464 [06:26:37]) even after he was warned. I assume this is why Mr. Medi (THE CAPTAIN) helps me kill him.

    Third and final point is that I understand taking things into your own hands after an Adminhelp is a no-no, but even if this guy had no notes, his intentions to grief are obviously no mistake.

    The fact the Captain of the station helped me kill him and that I was not the only one involved in him being removed from the round should have been taken into account by Boxpipe when considering how to punish me for "taking revenge".

    I believe there are multiple layers of valid for my actions despite me having already adminhelped this griefer, and that the choice of punishment was not just "incredibly harsh", it was an act borne out of Boxpipe's laziness to do proper admin investigating, his personal bias against me for being dissatisfied with his extremely lenient "punishment", and his overall inability to protect the server from those who make it their mission to ruin things for others by breaking rules.
     

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    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017 at 5:28 PM
  5. DinduStuffin

    DinduStuffin Game Master Staff Member Game Master

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    No, it wasn't a bias, or laziness, or any other tacked on, empty accusation. Rules are rules. Whether you're satisfied with the guy's punishment or not, you are not allowed to go after people who have been ahelped about and handled accordingly. Period. It doesn't matter how much you do or don't agree with the punishment dealt. It wasn't an act borne out of anything other than you violating the rules because you disagree with them.
     
  6. OP
    Secxs

    Secxs New Member

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    I was not the only one who went after him. Does the Captain assisting me with his death mean nothing? Does the fact that he continued to be a jerk after he was warned mean nothing? Boxpipe's warning obviously did a whole lot. Come on.

    How are my accusations empty? You yourself said the punishment was "incredibly harsh". Does that not hint at some bias against me? Does his laziness / bias not show when he adminkills me for killing someone the Captain of the station helped me with?
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017 at 5:36 PM
  7. DinduStuffin

    DinduStuffin Game Master Staff Member Game Master

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    Since when did a harsh punishment automatically equate to bias? That's quite a mighty leap in logic there. When I asked him about this, he didn't even mention you by name, or anything about you, just what you did. I think it's safe to say he doesn't care who you are.
     
  8. OP
    Secxs

    Secxs New Member

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    I'm not saying he cares who I am, just that he cares about me disagreeing with his decision enough to adminkill me instead of investigate the matter a bit more and see that the dude was perfectly valid to kill since he was being shit after his warning and the Captain of the station gave the green light / assisted in the killing himself.

    It could have been me or anyone else who disagreed with him and his punishment would likely have been the same. Feeling like the harshness of the punishment came from an emotional place is what I meant by bias. There was an element of objectivity missing. To be fair I did respond to his asking why I killed the guy with something along the lines of "it was revenge", but I feel like any other admin would have done a bit more digging during the incident itself and with the punishment afterwards as well.
     
    Last edited: Aug 14, 2017 at 6:48 PM
  9. DinduStuffin

    DinduStuffin Game Master Staff Member Game Master

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    You're making it out to sound like his life revolves around you disagreeing with him. It doesn't. This was an admin situation that was resolved, but you took it upon yourself to take revenge anyways. You could have just ahelped again that he was being a problem.
     
  10. OP
    Secxs

    Secxs New Member

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    The fact that the Captain himself was involved made me feel like my actions were valid. I felt it proved that it was not just me "taking revenge", since the person with the most authority on the station was supporting my actions it seemed unlikely to me that admins would need to be bothered with the ordeal.

    And no, his life does not revolve around me disagreeing with him. His life, like all our lives, revolve a great deal around our emotions. When emotions get in the way of making decisions that require some objectivity, especially when the person is in a position of authority, I believe it is good to be aware of them.
     
  11. DinduStuffin

    DinduStuffin Game Master Staff Member Game Master

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    See you're doing it again. You're making baseless assumptions about his investment in the situation because you didn't get your way. Maybe he didn't see the captain's involvement? I dunno. However that doesn't mean he's a complete manchild like you're pretending he is because you got gibbed over a situation you should have just ahelped.
     
  12. OP
    Secxs

    Secxs New Member

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    I don't see people ahelping every valid they kill. Also, this is more than just about my assumption that his emotions were involved in gibbing me. Boxpipe originally replied to my ahelp saying I had attacked first; I had to remind him that it was valid to attack someone for destroying your workplace, let alone all the work I put into R&D that shift. He clearly didn't do the investigatory work most other admins I have dealt with would have done. The same element of laziness is displayed in his ignorance of the captain being involved in my killing of the guy later on.
     
  13. DinduStuffin

    DinduStuffin Game Master Staff Member Game Master

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    It sounds like there's more to this so I'm going to see if I can get him to post his side of the story here.
    --- Double Post Merged, Aug 14, 2017 at 7:41 PM, Original Post Date: Aug 14, 2017 at 7:14 PM ---
    Since he can't post in the thread because of this fucking retarded TFA system, I'll post on his behalf.
    [​IMG]
     
  14. OP
    Secxs

    Secxs New Member

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    First off, I ahelped against him KILLING ME and smashing my shit, not just smashing my shit. BIG DIFFERENCE. The guy started destroying R&D, and when I attacked him for it he killed me with the excuse "I WAS ATTACKED FIRST". I believe this is called baiting, hence my sarcastic comment to Boxpipe about it being an IC issue.

    Second, I ahelp about a hulk in a hardsuit destroying R&D and beating me to crit, and the response I get from Boxpipe is "You attacked first." I have to defend myself in the ahelp against Boxpipe AND ICly against some shitter because Boxpipe initially decided it was valid for the guy to kill me for punching him as a hulk in a hardsuit a few times, after he broke in and obliterated my work area. How is this fair? Did Boxpipe look at the logs for longer than 2 seconds? Does he even know or remember that the guy killed me?

    Third, what does this guy's warning even look like? "Destroyed R&D as a hulk, warned"? How about "Baiting a guy into attacking him by destroying a heavily developed R&D workspace and then beat him into crit. Warned." I'm willing to bet it's something like the former, not the latter, since Boxpipe doesn't seem to remember the reason I ahelped to begin with.

    I guess using Boxpipe's logic it's okay to punish someone because two people ahelped against them. Why bother CHECKING THE LOGS? No chance the Captain helped with the whole thing and it wasn't just me taking revenge, right? No chance the guy continued destroying shit and trying to bait me after he was warned, because oh my goodness, a warning for deliberately baiting someone so you could kill them! Anything but that! He probably continued being a shitter because he wasn't even warned for killing me, just breaking things.

    There is nothing more to this story when you come at it from the perspective of a lazy apathetic admin who can't be bothered to spend 2 minutes checking logs when responding to an ahelp. The fact that he even brought up the two people ahelping me as some kind of alibi for his decision making is just evidence of that. If he would have done his job and checked the logs to begin with, I'd have gotten a different response than "You attacked first." If he would have done his job and checked the logs after, I'd have likely gotten a more compassionate and understanding response from Boxpipe than him admin-gibbing me, as he'd have seen that I had valid reasons to kill the dude despite me telling him it was just out of revenge.
     
    Last edited: Aug 15, 2017 at 12:17 AM

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